Dude again you need to check your facts. NOBODY is storing hydrogen as a compressed gas or a liquid. Well I stand corrected if your trying to get into a low orbit around the planet. Liquid Hydrogen is a great way to achieve that. But we are not talking about making rocket motors we are talking about cars.

For one hydrogen is not a very dense gas and doesnt compress well. ALL of the storage methods in use right now are through chemically bonded storage media. The storage media themselves contains the hydrogen and IT is ONLY released when the tanks are heated.

YOU DO NOT PUT LIQUID HYDROGEN IN AN INTERNAL COMBUSTION ENGINE. That is by far the dumbest thing I've ever heard. DUDE CHECK YOUR FACTS, DONT SPREAD WRONG INFORMATION.

For the individual consumer a home hydrogen station is ideal and thats using the electroylisis method. Your statistics do not apply to this situation. Applying larger amounts of energy in the production of hydrogen through the electroylsis method does not create hydrogen any faster. In fact it causes the very net energy loss that you are touting.

Its a matter of physics. But for the indivual user pulling little more energy than would be required to charge an electric vehicle. You are making clean energy at home with no distrubution cost and virtually eliminating the oil industry. A cleaner life cycle anaylsis.... but dont worry I will not expect your believe my word. But as soon as I get home I'll dig out the DOE life cycle analysis.

Again you are lambasting another technology, just because it isnt bio-d. Bio-d is hardly perfect. No more perfect than hydrogen. You cannot expect an alternative energy to simply wash away the sins of petroleum dependancy. Its unrealistic.

Now as far as peak oil and all the rest of the Armageddon theories are concerned. Petroluem is not the end all be all. Everything that is being made from dino oil is readily and just as easily made from soy or hemp or peanuts or the 101 other plants species that have 101 other uses.

Granted while their will be a change in the way things happen in the economy should oil suddenly collapse or whatever, you have to know that the other technologies have been surpressed because of the oil industry but not in spite of them.

Now the final thing. I have solar panels and so what they are made from petroluem products. It doesnt stop them from producing the electricity that will produce the hydrogen that fuels my vehicle. Maybe one day, someone will wise up and make the panels out of soy plastic or whatever else applicable green technology exsist. However my ability to produce fuel locally, that burns cleaner and isnt reliant on crops, well thats just incredible.

I've never said anything about cheap energy. All energy has a cost wether it be environmental or monetary. Reducing the level of pollution is of firstmost. Bio-d is a great option, and it really puts things into the hands of the end user alot more directly. However its simply not the best across the board. Nothing is, AND ALL OF IT IS STILL RELIANT ON PETRO IN SOME KIND OF WAY, and I think you know that, or at least I hope you do.

I am considering converting my gasoline engine over to a hydrogen system. Is anyone aware of a really good DVD to show how to do this? Where to get the parts etc.? Or, is this a bad Idea?

Any suggestions?

I saw a video of a guy that did this himself & he got 200 MPG without a hybrid. It was on the news.

I just found this thread so, I'll check out the links.

Of course,

I was actually aiming for spark ignition vs compression ignition. I forgot the stat that Diesel vehicles make up ~3-4% of the vehicles on the road.

Like "Both are rely on internal..." its just one of those things where thinking in stream of conscious doesnt relate well on the screen.

Some other differences between gasoline and diesel is that a gas engine draws fuel on the intake stroke prior to compression, and diesel is sprayed into the cylinder on the compression stroke.

Or how about this diesel vehicles typically have about 20-40% more miles per gallon than a comparable gasoline vehicle.

I could go on and on with the stats until you bleed diesel like I do. But I'll spare you. I hope that you out of all that I wrote the only thing that you read was not just simple flub about internal combustion engines, obviously you knew what I was talking about otherwise you wouldnt be correcting me.

Anyways you should come join my Diesel Power tribe, and we can compare the differences between internal combustion engines where it is on topic! tribes.tribe.net/dieselpower

I'm at the Transportation Research Board Meeting [Conference] ( trb.org/meeting/ ) all this week and I've been talking with Feds about the coming changes in diesel technology, as well many other topics that are not directly related. Its all very exciting stuff.
Hopefully one day more environmental and alternative energy solutions, research and proposals will get some more recognition at meetings like this. Currently and primarily the focus is on the civil engineering aspects of city building, but I have been able to get to a couple sessions on green highway building/maintenance and also a session on the BRT system in Mexico. But I'm still learning, the most important things with these meetings are the networking that goes on and the "in the pipeline" information.

Anyways that is certainly off topic for post this posting and this tribe so I'll stop there.

I gotta thank you for reminding me about this thread. I have some info for chopper22 concerning the question that he wrote earlier in this thread.

I'll seperate that reply into a seperate posting.